Interview with Laura Jayes, AM Agenda

13 March 2024

LAURA JAYES: Welcome back you're watching AM Agenda and here on AM Agenda would be going on about the GST deal and the unfairness of it all when it comes to the carve up between the states. WA is getting a very sweet deal indeed. Why? Because both major parties need to either win or retain seats in WA to hold government. That means next financial year WA will be getting an extra $5.2 billion. And where does that money come from? It comes from taxpayers in other states. Let's bring in the Shadow Finance Minister Jane Hume. Now, Jane, thanks so much for your time, but major parties are pretty curiously quiet about this saying the states other than WA just need to sort out their budgets. What do you think?

JANE HUME: Well, states certainly do need to sort out their budget. But let's take a step back, Laura, the GST carve up is guided by the Commonwealth Grants Commission. And they refer to a number of different factors, a number of different data in order to make that decision. It's not at all unusual for premiers to come to the federal government, whether it be a Labor government or whether it be a Coalition government, with their hands out asking for more, asking for a better deal. And of course, that's what's happened this time around. And we know that that's what happened. Now, what is disappointing, though, is when those premiers or those states that haven't managed their budgets particularly well use this as an opportunity for essentially a commonwealth government bailout for their mismanagement-

LAURA JAYES: Hang on, that's exactly what WA's getting a commonwealth government bailout.

JANE HUME: Let's not forget that the GST was put in place originally because we wanted to get rid of those inefficient and frankly unproductive taxes.

LAURA JAYES: That didn't happen.

JANE HUME: Now you look at a state like Victoria, like Victoria that really the only reason it is getting more GST this time around is because it's going backwards it's real disposable income has gone backwards the value of its goods and services have gone backwards but its population has gone up and that's why Victoria has got a bigger carve out the pie this time around. Now you know that said this is a state that is going broken has in fact imposed more taxes on its citizens. Things like the ridiculous 7.5% vacancy bed tax on Airbnb's. Now, this is not the way to run an economy and certainly not something that we should be rewarding. However, this is a decision of the Commonwealth Grants Commission and it's not-

LAURA JAYES: Well there is a better off overall test, or no worse off test was actually the Morrison government, Turnbull Government, Morrison was treasurer. It's really hard to justify, isn't it? Why WA should get these extra billions of dollars when they're also benefiting from the rivers of gold that come from iron ore royalties.

JANE HUME: And again, that was something that the Commonwealth Grants Commission pointed out that Victoria was a state that didn't benefit from those royalties, which is why it got more this time around. The decision to put in a better off overall test was part of the decision around WA which at the time that floor underneath their GST was made was to make it a fairer system.

LAURA JAYES: It's not fair though is it? How is it fair?

JANE HUME: The Commonwealth Grants Commission takes that into account when it makes its decisions. While the Commonwealth Grants Commission takes that into account, when it makes us decisions on the GST carve up. The decision to continue the 'no worse off' test has been one of Jim Chalmers was a three year transition decision. It's now been extended for another three years. That's really a decision, that's a question for him.

LAURA JAYES: Yeah well, kind of. This is legislation, as I say that was imposed by Morrison, when he was Treasurer, and the Commonwealth Grants Commission can only make decisions on the parameters, the federal government sets.

JANE HUME: And this was a decision made at the time in the circumstances at the time, and it was seemed to be a fair decision at that point in time because WA was essentially punching above its weight but receiving less GST-

LAURA JAYES: Is it still fair?

JANE HUME: -notionally than the rest of the country. Now the decision to continue on with that decision is one for the Government.

LAURA JAYES: Okay, do you think it should maybe come to the end of its life, then? Would you extend it?

JANE HUME: Well, that's the decision for the Government and we are not the government. We are the opposition. When we put that position in place. It was because it was a fairer way to carve up the GST. WA was missing out. It was being unfairly treated. Now the decision is one for the Government to make.

LAURA JAYES: Okay, let's talk about nuclear now. There was a promise from Labor before the last election that bills, energy bills would be $275 cheaper. If you go down this nuclear path, when are people's bills going to be cheaper and by how much?

JANE HUME: Well, the decision to follow the nuclear path as you put it, is one that is not ideological. Essentially, the decision is one about the energy mix, making sure that we have reliable energy but we also have more affordable energy in the long term as well as cleaner energy. We know that the decision to reach net zero by 2050 that's been made by other countries has been supported in more than 30 of them by nuclear energy. And in fact, there's 50 that are considering that as part of their mix on the pathway to net zero by 2050. The fact that Australia has not gone down this route, is simply a matter of ideological belligerence. Labor's opposition to nuclear energy, even just to something as basic as lifting the moratorium seems to be both illogical but also incoherent and inconsistent. If you want that pathway to net zero by 2050, to make sure that we have a reliable energy grid as well as a cleaner and greener energy grid, why would you not consider nuclear as part of the solution? And I say part of the solution intentionally, renewables are going to be fundamentally important to our energy mix in the future. But why would you discount a an emissions free technology that could potentially deliver cleaner, greener and cheaper energy in the long term?

LAURA JAYES: Well the Coalition had 10 years in power to prosecute this important idea. Why didn't you? It's pretty hard to do from Opposition.

JANE HUME: And one of the things that we did prosecute in when in government was the idea that economics not ideology, economics and engineering, not ideology should determine our energy mix. Economics and engineering have now come a long way just in the last decade alone. And we're now looking at these small modular nuclear reactors as well as new traditional reactors that may potentially have the ability to provide that baseload power that will make our grid more efficient, that will make our grid more reliable, but also deliver cheaper energy for our future. Is it something that we can switch not tomorrow, of course not but why would we not?

LAURA JAYES: How far in the future? I mean, it's 10 years.

JANE HUME: Well, not necessarily, you know, there's demonstrations around in other countries. I think that Ted O'Brien raised the UAE, for instance, that had a nuclear reactor up within three years. Now, can we do that here? There's an awful lot of hurdles to jump in hoops to go through before that period of time. But the first one surely would be lifting the moratorium on nuclear energy in this country that would at least allow the market to make those decisions. And again, you know, why would you not have something that could potentially provide efficient, safe, reliable power at a cheaper price in the long term.

LAURA JAYES: Okay, bit of explaining to do and prosecuting to do over the next couple of months and years, I might suggest. But Jane Hume good to start it or keeping it going here, will speak to you soon.

JANE HUME: There will be, there will be much more. There'll be much more Laura, I promise you watch this space. But we're not announcing policy on your programme today. But there will be more very soon.

LAURA JAYES: Shame, we always like that to happen. So I'll press you for next time. We'll see you soon, Jane.