Interview with Natalie Barr, Sunrise

27 March 2024

NATALIE BARR: Well, the government has caved to pressure and watered down its new carbon emissions laws for vehicles. If you've got a ute or a four wheel drive, take a big, deep breath because it paves the way for softer emissions targets. This all comes after criticism that more ambitious targets would force up car prices and create less choice for consumers. For more, let's bring in Home Affairs Minister Clare O'Neil and shadow Finance Minister Jane Hume. Good morning to both of you. Clare, this is a pretty significant backdown. Did the government get spooked that voters weren't going to buy the plan?

CLARE O’NEIL: Actually Nat, I would characterise this very differently. If I could just explain to your viewers. Car pollution is one of the main drivers of pollutants in our air and a big contributor to climate change and Australia is one of the only countries in the world that does not have vehicle emissions standards on cars and on vehicles on our roads. So this is a problem that the Coalition had a couple of goes at correcting when they were in office. They were advocating for something to be done about this when they were in government and couldn't land the reform and actually what the Labor government has done here has reached a really good position. We are going to put in place emission standards on vehicles and you would have seen yesterday that our Climate Change Minister and other Ministers stood up with the CEOs of major car companies who are actually enthused to get this in place. It's not right for Australia, a country so affected by pollution and by climate change, to not have the government acting on these things and that's why our governments reached this really good position that I'm very proud of.

NATALIE BARR: Jane, it is true that without intervention, uh, the transport emissions would be the biggest source of pollution in this country by the end of the decade. So do you back this?

JANE HUME: Well, of course, the Coalition supports reducing emissions. Of course we do, but not at the expense of consumers of consumer choice and particularly those consumers that may want to buy an SUV or a ute or may have to buy one of those cars that is disproportionately affected by this emissions vehicles tax, which will then compensate electric vehicle drivers. So the Coalition won't be supporting this move because we don't think it's fair on ordinary Australians who may want to buy an SUV.

NATALIE BARR: Aren't they reclassified now as commercial vehicles? The Land Cruisers?

JANE HUME: Why is it that these cars, that sales of these cars that Australians love and often need, are compensating those who might want to buy an electric vehicle, but it isn't technology agnostic. Why is it that we're not that, uh, hybrid vehicles are not included? Why is it that potentially biofuel vehicles aren't included? We want a technology agnostic approach. We want to make sure that Australian consumers aren't unfairly punished.

NATALIE BARR: Okay. Moving on it news this morning, Clare, there's a report that you were blindsided by one of the nation's top public servants who released a document revealing that of those freed 149 former detainees, seven were convicted of murder or attempted murder, 37 were of sexual offenses, 72 of assault and violent offending, kidnapping or armed robbery. Clare, you apparently didn't want this information out there. What's your response to that, these allegations?

CLARE O’NEIL: Well Nat, our government's really committed to transparency. The information was requested of government. Government provided the information to the public. So I'm not actually really sure where this story has come from and what it's all about. I think the important thing is for your viewers to understand that the information was requested and the government provided it. Not sure what the news interest is in that one actually.

NATALIE BARR: Jane, the government's you know, rushing these new laws into Parliament, there's allegations that from seven government sources that, you know, that the government tried to hide the fact that there were murderers, rapists and attempted rapists in this 149.

JANE HUME: This saga has been one of chaos and incompetence from day one and right down to the rushed legislation that we've seen presented to the Coalition yesterday, which we were told was urgent but in fact had a date stamp on it dated four days prior. So we question how urgent this legislation was if it wasn't revealed to the Coalition until four days after it was ready. But now today we're hearing that it's not just chaos, not just incompetence, but potentially conspiracy to deceive too and I think, Clare, the question for you here is, did either you, did anyone in your office, did anyone in your government direct a public servant to either delay or to keep confidential information that had been asked for by the Australian public, by the Senate? That's the question that needs to be asked here.

NATALIE BARR: Clare?

CLARE O’NEIL: Well, I mean, we're back here again with Jane hyperventilating a bit about legislation before the Parliament. If I can just say to your viewers, we've introduced-

JANE HUME: If this is a conspiracy to deceive, it's not hyperventilating. This is not transparency. This is not integrity.

CLARE O’NEIL: You're actually sounding crazy right now. Jane, you’re actually sounding crazy right now.

JANE HUME: And you sound like you're lying Clare.

CLARE O’NEIL: That’s very rude, but what the government is doing is putting in place a bill this week to give the Australian government a really important power that we should already have had, and that is the power to compel people who are not cooperating with government to allow their removal from our country.

JANE HUME: Did you direct a public servant to keep a piece of information confidential?

NATALIE BARR: Clare, could you just answer that one and then we'll move on to something else?

CLARE O’NEIL: Yes. Sorry, I actually can't hear the question Nat because Jane keeps talking over the top of me. What is it that you're asking?

NATALIE BARR: Did you direct a public servant to delay the release of that information? The fact that they were murderers and rapists?

CLARE O’NEIL: No.

NATALIE BARR: Okay, great. Let's move on.

JANE HUME: Did anybody in your government direct a public servant to keep that information confidential or delay?

NATALIE BARR: Okay last one. Clare, can you answer that?

CLARE O’NEIL: Um, I didn't direct the public servant to do this. This is a little bit of a silly line of questioning. If I could say very respectfully-

NATALIE BARR: Anyone in your office Clare?

CLARE O’NEIL: The information was requested of the government, and the government provided the information to the public. So I'm not sure what the alleged conspiracy is coming from Jane this morning.

NATALIE BARR: Okay. Finally, big story this morning in AFL. Federal MP Andrew Wilkie has accused one of the AFL's top doctors of carrying out illicit off the books drug tests to help Melbourne Demons players evade drug detection. Clare, the allegation is that the players were told to fake an injury if they got positive tests. There was wilful inaction at the very top of the AFL including the chairman and the CEO. What's your reaction to these details?

CLARE O’NEIL: Look, Nat, I haven't read about the allegations beyond what you've just outlined there, so I think we'll wait to hear a little bit more about the story. I just say with the AFL we've got such high expectations. These people are such important leaders for our community and for young people. We do want them to do the right thing. So it will be important to get to the bottom of this.

NATALIE BARR: Jane, your response to Andrew Wilkie's allegations?

JANE HUME: Yeah. Look, these were allegations made under parliamentary privilege, and they probably do need to be further investigated. Certainly AFL players are not above the law, but also the officials within the AFL have a duty of care to the welfare of players and I think that is worth further investigation.

NATALIE BARR: Okay. Thank you very much for a very robust chat. Um, we'll see you next week. Uh, have a great day.

JANE HUME: Thanks, Nat.